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04-26-1982 PC MIN ELK RIVER PLANNING CO}fMISSION }illETING HELD AT THE ELK RIVER PUBLIC LIBRARY Monday, April 26, 1982 ~llillBERS PRESENT: Chairman Tracy, Commissioners Fredericksen, Pearce, Gunkel and Kreuser. STAFF PRESENT: Rick Breezee, Building and Zoning Administrator 1. Meeting Called to Order The meeting was called to order by Chairman Tracy at 7:30 p.m. 2. Agenda Item #ll~ - Rick Foster requested to present to the Commission a concept of the Lundgren proposal. No motion or discussion will be necessary for this request at this time. Also, the concept of a roll call for voting on motions presented to the Planning Commission was added to the Agenda as Item 3~. 3. Minutes Chairman Tracy indicated that at the meeting of March 22, 1982, he voted on all items; therefore, it should be noted in the minutes of that meeting that the vote was 5-0 instead of 4-0 as published. CO}1MISSIONER PEARCE MADE A MOTION TO ACCEPT THE MINUTES AS CORRECTED FOR THE MARCH 22, 1982 PLANNING COMMISSION MEETING. CO~lISSIONER GUNKEL SECONDED THE MOTION. THE MOTION PASSED 5-0. 3~. Rick Breezee indicated to the Planning Commission that staff would like to incorp- orate a roll call system for voting on motions made by the Planning Commission. Discussion followed and the Planning Commission all agreed to adopt the roll call system. CHAIRMAN TRACY MADE A MOTION TO ADOPT THE ROLL CALL SYSTEM OF RECORDING VOTES FOR MOTIONS MADE BY THE PLANNING CO}frfISSION. THE MOTION PASSED 5-0. 4. Consider Barthel Preliminary Plat Approval - Public Hearing Chairman Tracy indicated staff has asked for more time to consider the Barthel Pre- liminary Plat for approval. He then asked a representative from the Barthel Com- pany to explain their project to the audience present for the public hearing. Rick Breezee explained that Barthel is aware that staff is asking for this to be tabled tonight and when the final hearing is to be held, notices will be sent to the newspaper and also to residents involved in this area within 350 feet of the proposal. He further indicated that it has been agreed upon by staff and the Bar- thel Company to present their preliminary plat and then continue the public hearing to the next Planning Commission meeting. Planning Commission Minutes April 26, 1982 Page T\\TO Marlin Hutchinson, representing Barthel Company, introduced their architect for the project, Mr. Dick Larson. Mr. Larson explained that the PUD is 4l acres which will consist of a number of parcels, 4-plex connected type housing, a restaurant, a bank, a shopping center, a free standing retail commercial building, and an office building. This is a .total of six separate uses. He indicated that ~. Barthel has submitted to the City a number of documents showing lot lines, land- scaping, elevations, etc. The shopping center, restaurant, and bank are in- itially proposed to be developed at this time. A new road possibly connecting Gates Avenue with School Street which will go through approximately the center of the project with sewer and water and storm drains for the project, also will be discussed. None of the sewers, etc. have been finally engineered. Barthel has submitted preliminary grading plans showing road elevations and elevations of various parcels. Mr. Larson also indicated what type of buffering would be used for the project. Mr. Larson further indicated that the City has a 75 foot wide easement on the west boundary of the proposal. Barthel will be using mixed carn- iverous plantings as a landscaping buffer from existing homes between them and the PUD. Chairman Tracy opened the Public Hearing at 7:47 p.m. Mr. Tony Hipp, a resident of Elk River, indicated that he liked the concept but that he felt a frontage road would possibly be needed for that area. Right now there mayor may not be a need for a frontage road, but he stated that presently Evans deadends at the south end of the PUD. He further indicated there would be a large amount of traffic coming through the PUD. He felt there should be a front- age road built to accomodate this area or possibly land set aside for this purpose. Marlin Hutchinson indicated that Barthel is in the process of making application to the Highway Department for another access to the Highway. He showed that the in- gress and egress at two points in the PUD would possibly do as much as anything to alleviate traffic as a frontage road would. Mr. Hipp indicated to Mr. Hutchinson that it would be almost impossible to get across Highway #169. Mr. Hutchinson stated that what they are proposing is not a crossing at #169, but an ingress and egress to the shopping center for traffic traveling north to south. Mr. Hipp then questioned the extension of Evans. Mr. Hutchinson stated that Evans would remain as a dead end. The people of the area such as the nursing home and the elderly housing discouraged Evans going through. He further indicated that walkways were proposed to go through the area to the center. Commissioner Pearce asked Mr. Hipp what advantage would a service road do over what Gates Avenue will be doing? Mr. Hipp felt that with people shopping at peak shopping periods, that it may be Planning Commission Minutes April 26, 1982 Page Three difficult to get in and out of that area. He also stated he was going back to something that people in the neighborhood were given to understand before by the City, that their concept \Vas almost like an "L" shape. He felt that if this was viable, people shopping in the downtown area might go to the shopping center and then go back again and it might prove to be difficult with only one access getting into the shopping center. Jim LaRock, a resident of Elk River, indicated that he was concerned about the build up of traffic on School Street and Main Street. He felt that some sort of egress off Highway #169 would relieve pressure from those two streets. Perhaps a right turn lane off #169 would be able to relieve traffic. Mr. Hutchinson stated again that a request is in at the Highway Department for such an egress and ingress. He indicated it had not been turned down as of this date nor had it been approved. Mr. LaRock also asked about an 8' sidewalk proposed coming off 8th Street. He was concerned about the 8' width of the sidewalk. He felt that it was too wide and that a 4' wide sidewalk would be better. He also indicated that possibly a speed bump could be utilized. Gary Santwire, a developer in Elk River, asked Mr. Hutchinson how big Building A and Building Fare. Mr. Hutchinson stated that the shopping center building itself is 110,000 square feet in area, with 95,000 net leasible. Building F will be 41,000 square feet. Building F would possibly be a home care center such as Menards, although this has not been established at this time. Mr. Santwire indicated that the exact occupant could not be determined in the PUD. Mr. Hutchinson indicated that they are basically looking for a commercial tennant. Mr. Santwire asked if the south parcel shown on the map was part of this proposal. Rick Breezee indicated that the land is zoned PUD but that it is not a part of this PUD being presented. Gary Santwire asked if this area isn't 20 acres, how could it be a PUD. Rick Breezee did not know at this time. Chairman Tracy stated that a year ago, a representative of Mr. George Dietz came in and indicated that the area was all under one o\vnership. Mike O'Brien, a resident in the audience, asked a question as to whether the trees on both edges of the PUD would be planted at the time of construction. Mr. Hutchinson indicated that as part of the PUD, Barthel will be planting the trees at the time of construction. Planning Commission Minutes April 26, 1982 Page Four Mike O'Brien then inquired about possible dust control during construction. Mr. Hutchinson indicated that he doesn't know if there was a lot that can be done about dust. They didn't plan to disturb any more of the property than they had to. Rick Breezee also stated that in the PUD across the highway, there was quite a bit of earth work being done; hence the dust. For Barthel, he felt that there was not going to be a great deal of earth moving being done. Julie Hipp, a resident, inquired about the plans for storm sewer and drainage. Mr. Larson indicated that the storm sewer was the City's concern. Although he understood it would start on School Street and run south and be reconnected all the way do\vu to the river. Rick Breezee indicated that the City is looking at a total storm water project that includes part of that area. The storm sewer line would come down through Gates and connect and go underneath Main Street and Highway #10 and hopefully, connect with another project that is going on School Street. This project is in the Council's hands and being looked at through Consulting Engineers Diversified. He felt a lot of the water was going dO\Vll School Street almost past Jackson. Now he thought a lot of it would come down Gates. Jim LaRock indicated that the original concept was to put pipe in the newly re- built School Street and take the storm water from School Street on the eastern end and pipe it do\vu past Jackson, past the farm house do\Vll by the Senior High School and put it in a holding pond between Central Luthern Church and the Missionary Alliance Church. Now the engineers are looking at taking that pipe and turning it to drain off to the south. Mr. LaRock then indicated that he had another concern about the PUD damaging do\vuto\Vll businesses. He indicated that if he was in business downtown, he would leave because the type of businesses pr~posed for the PUD. He is also concerned about what will happen to the east end of the City. He further in- dicated that when he bought the house there on the east side, he did not think he would be living in the middle of a commercial area. He felt that the Planning Commission should address themselves to the concern of businesses in the do\vnto\Vll area. Elaine Anderson, a resident of Elk River, inquired if there had been any study done in regard to the effect a IDall would have on do\vuto\VTI Elk River. She indicated that Monticello has a mall and asked if anyone was aware of such a study. Jim LaRock stated that the mall in Monticello was much smaller than the one proposed in Elk River. Commissioner Pearce indicated that he understood Barthel was requested to make a study on the impact on the do'vnto\~ area and asked if such a study had been made. Laura Manske, a representative from Barthel, stated that what Barthel was following in this proposal, was a study done by Zack Johnson, the City Planner. This type of Planning Commission Minutes April 26, 1982 Page Fiv"e facility is the one he proposed 2 years ago. As of yet, Barthel has not proceeded with another study. Ms. Manske also indicated that this PUD is in fact smaller than the one Mr. Johnson had proposed. Marlin Hutchinson, Barthel, indicated that Zack Johnson's report indicated initially a gross leasible area of approximately 101,000 square feet. Barthel is at 95,000 gross leasible area. This is slightly smaller. Chairman Tracy asked what the acreage of the shopping center would be. Mr. Hutchinson indicated that the shopping center itself, including Sections H and J, which are reserved for expansion of the grocery store, is 12.5 acres. With- out the expansion space, it is almost 10 acres. Parcel A is about 10 acres. He further indicated that Barthel has proceeded along the lines that the City has planned for. The City's study determined where the site for the shopping center should be, they (the City) proposed the connecting road and the size. Chairman Tracy indicated that he felt that the Commission has to look at the concern of this PUD and the downtown area. How much space is available that could possibly pullout any downtown interests. Ms. Manske indicated possibly six or seven businesses, which anchor tennants. included the four A member of the audience asked about the size of trees that will be used for buffer- ing on the west edge of the PUD. Mr. Hutchinson indicated that they plan to plant 1/2" to 2~" diameter decidous trees. Carniverous trees would probably be 5". He also indicated that the trees presently there are serving as a barrier and would be left there. Julie Hipp asked who would take care of the trees, expecially if they died. Mr. Hutchinson stated that he thought the land otvuer would take care of them. Rick Breezee indicated that this point would be taken care of at the time after the final plat is approved and a developer's agreement is entered into. Gary Santwire asked if this project will be totally self-supporting. Will the development pay for its O\VTI improvements, site work, how will it all be assessed against the property or are they suggesting some type of bonds to do that. Rick Breezee felt that at the concept phase, Barthel Construction has asked for one type of financing and that a while back, they asked for IRE's. However, at this time, this is a preliminary procedure, and we are looking only at the land use and that the question of financing cannot be asked or answered. Neither the staff nor the Commission knows about financing yet. He indicated that everyone will be notified how this will be accomplished at the proper time. Commissioner Pearce indicated that all this would be included in the final PUD. Planning Commission Minutes April 26, 1982 Page Six Chairman Tracy asked if there were any further questions from the public. There being no further questions, Chairman Tracy closed the public hearing at 8:15 p.m. Re opened the discussion to the Planning Commission for their comments. Commissioner Gunkel asked why, since the concept presentation, the size of the main shopping center building itself, has increased by about 30,000 feet. Mr. Hutchinson stated that since the original concept, interest has increased in the center. Also, because of interest by major tennants, these major tennants don't pay as high a rent and in order to make the finances work more smoothly, the size of the center is increased by getting more smaller shops. He also stated that he knew that the City's basic thoughts on planning this PUD was to plan it so they could expand it to take care of all the commercial development that might occur so they wouldn't have to be putting in another shopping center somewhere else. Commissioner Gunkel indicated to Barthel that the Commission asked them to be more specific in some of the places that have expressed an interest in the center. She asked if there was a reason they could not be more specific. Laura Manske indicated that the anchors of the center are a grocery store, hardware store, a variety store and a drug store. She clarified a question she was asked earlier about how many people from do\vuto\Vll were interested. She was unsure of how the Planning Commission defined "downtown". As for the area south of the railroad tracks, the variety store has expressed an interest in the center. The smaller tennants may pull from Elk River, but some may be franchises. Commissioner Gunkel asked what kind of stores she will have access to that she doesn't have now. Ms. Manske stated that Barthel is at a point where they have just finished with the anchor tennants. She has a leasing process that has to be followed. Commissioner Gunkel asked what was estimated to exist there; things have changed considerable since the studies were done. Ms. Manske indicated she can only go on the ones that have already been given to her. Commissioner Gunkel asked the Barthel people if they have determined what the name of the street extension will be. Mr. Hutchinson stated that he assumed it would be an extension of Gates. Commissioner Gunkel stated that it was being referred to as an extension of Gates but she hoped that it would be named something else as she did not want to have to change all her papers because she presently lived on Gates Avenue that is to the west of the proposed center. Rick Breezee indicated that it would be changed; that it couldn't be Gates and that it will be up to the City to decide on the name. Planning Commission Minutes April 26, 1982 Page Seven Commissioner Gunkel then stated that she just wanted to clarify that point because it keeps being referred to as "Gates" and there are quite a fe'\\T people in the "hop scotching" setup of Gates. She then asked '\\Then Barthel '\vould kno'\\T the i;vid th of the side\valk. Discussion followed in which Mr. Larson stated that Barthel was not recommending any particular width for the sidewalk. Mr. Larson further stated that the City sets the perimeters of sidewalks, not the developer. Chairman Tracy asked Rick Breezee if the width of sidewalks should be identified in the proposal. Rick Breezee stated that now in the preliminary stages, if the Planning Commission wanted to specify the width of such a sidewalk, they could specify such. Commissioner Pearce felt that the Planning Commission should not put a restriction on the size of the sidewalk at this time. He felt that this was not the time to do this type of thing. Commissioner Gunkel felt that because she lives right at the end of where the side- walk is going to come out, she would personally prefer it not be any wider than a standard sidewalk. She did not know if the standard width was 3 or 4 feet. Rick Breezee stated that there is really no set standard size. The sidewalk could be 3 feet, 3~ feet, or even 4 feet. The reason for the sidewalk is to have ped- estrian traffic, not vehicular traffic and as such, it should be wide enough to allow a pedestrian to travel comfortably both ways with handicapped people being considered. Commissioner Gunkel felt that if the sidewalk was constructed wide, then there would be a lot of bicycles, mini bikes, and everything else using it. Rick Breezee indicated that the sidewalk could be designed to incorporate posts, chains, or a berm to stop major vehicular traffic. Commissioner Gunkel felt that even with those types of things, it would not stop them from using it. Chairman Tracy asked Rick Breezee to clarify the reason for the sidewalk. Rick Breezee indicated that first of all, the sewer lateral is going across from the interceptor which ties into the shopping center where all the sewage will go, so the City has requested Barthel to create an easement at that point. Also, staff has suggested that Barthel put a pedestrian walkway there so that the people on the west side of that whole western area can get to the shopping center without having to travel on roads. Jim LaRock indicated that the sidewalk would end on a street at both ends. 8th Street has no sidewalks nor does School Street have sidewalks, except what the School District has constructed on the north side. He further indicated that there are not many sidewalks in the whole area in question. He was concerned about too much traffic going through the area, and with an eight foot sidewalk, it will be Planning Commission Minutes April 26,1982 Page Eight too easy to open up 8th Street as a through street. He felt that the area would become very busy with traffic. He did not want to see all these streets becom- ing open. Commissioner Gunkel inquired as to why the lateral was placed where it was, and could it be moved down. Rick Breezee indicated that the depth of the lateral was the reason it was placed where it was, and also because of a manhole at that point. Marlin Hutchinson stated to the Planning Commission that it was not Barthel that was requesting the sidewalk, but rather the City was. This request was the City's request, not Barthel. Commissioner Gunkel asked Barthel if the 1;olhole access "thing" could be eliminated. She indicated that this 1;olas a personal request at this point, not a request of--- the Planning Commission. Commissioner Kreuser then stated that anyone that lives on 8th Street in that area and wants to walk to the shopping center, cannot do so if the sidewalk is eliminated. Commissioner Kreuser felt that there should be some type of access between the buildings. Rick Breezee feels that first of all, the sidewalk will not be an 8 foot wide side- walk. He felt that it 1;vould only be 1;vide enough for tl:vO flo1;vs of traffic - either pedestrian or wheel chair. He also felt there should be a sidewalk so that people on the west portion can get to the center without having to drive all over the City. Commissioner Gunkel stated that what was dra\vu on the plan goes directly into the neighborhood that doesn't want the sidewalk. She indicated that this neighborhood was represented at this meeting, and they don't want it. She felt if a walkway was wanted, then it should be moved d01;vu. Commissioner Gunkel also discussed a possible way for it to be moved d01;vu. She felt that a sidewalk would not pro- vide that much. It goes into a relatively small neighborhood area and "1;ve" don't want it, so if Barthel is willing to take the sidewalk out, do so. Rick Breezee stated that a sidewalk must start and end at some public street or easement and not just start in the middle of someones backyard for public use. Mr. Larson stated again that this decision was up to the City, not Barthel. Commissioner Gunkel stated that she would also like some feedback from the do\vn- town businessmen and how they feel about the shopping center. At this time, no one from the dO\vutO'Vll area was present at the meeting. Rick Breezee asked the Planning Commission if they would like him to get in touch personally with the dO\vut01;Vll people and make them aware of the public hearing when it is continued. Planning Commission Minutes April 26, 1982 Page Nine A member of the audience indicated that he had talked to a couple of people from the downto\vu area, and some of them felt that 1) they hadn't heard of anything going on and 2) the do\vutown businessmen would also like some type of financing that was spoken about for the shopping center. Chairman Tracy felt that the downtown probably is aware of what is happening, and they don't need to be notified personally. Commissioner Gunkel felt that there have been plenty of opportunities for the downtown people to be made aware of what was happening. If there is no senti- ment one way or another expressed, it was not kno\vu how many intended to stay '\vhere they are. Chairman Tracy felt that this plan must be looked at with what the HRA is doing. He then tabled this preliminary plat approval to the next Planning Commission. Marlin Hutchinson asked if a special meeting could be arranged because of the time factor involved in getting this proect moving. Chairman Tracy could see no problem in setting up a sepcial meeting. He then stated that a special Planning Commission meeting will be held Monday, May 10, 1982, at 7:30 at the Library. Rick Breezee indicated that the City w~ll notify people within 350 feet of the proposed project and then the City will publisize the public hearing in the Star News. He further asked the Planning Commission if they felt he should notify the businessmen in the do\vutown area. Commissioner Kreuser stated that he doesn't feel the function of the Planning Com- mission is to worry about do\vntown. They only look at sites, setbacks, concepts, etc., not about whether or not someone was notified or not. He further stated that this is a free enterprise system of business, and he does not think the Planning Commission can tell Barthel that they can't build a shopping center because do\vn- town people don't want it. Rick Breezee indicated to the Planning Commission that the reason the staff needs more time, was to look at storm sewer, water, etc. He felt that the City cannot regulate competition, either. Commissioner Gunkel felt that there is a need to be concerned with an orderly gro\vth pattern. Discussion followed regarding the tax increment financing. Since this was not part of the public hearing, no motion was needed. 5. Consider H & S Ashalt Conditional Use Permit Bill Miller, representing H & S Asphalt, presented to the Planning Commission an explanation of the various topography maps for this project. Planning Commission Minutes April 26, 1982 Page Ten Discussion followed bet\veen Mr. Miller and the Planning Commission. Chairman Tracy asked Rick Breezee if all the standards for this request could be met. Rick Breezee indicated that all items could be met. He then stated that Item #4 will be taken care of at the time of license application. The license applica- tion is a very stringent one and is needed for such operations. Mr. Miller explained that the "dump area" is regulated by the peA. H & Stakes gravel out, creating the hole. Garbage is then put in the hole, then H & S fills the hole. He further indicated that the contours must also be met as set forth by the peA. COMMISSIONER PEARCE MADE A MOTION TO RECOM}ffiND APPROVAL OF THE CONDITIONAL USE PERHIT REQUEST BY H & S ASPHALT INC., FOR THE EXTRACTION OF MINERALS WITH THE TI}ffi PERIOD AS FOLLOWS: TRACT A - 2 YEARS, TRACT B-30 YEARS, TRACT C - 30 YEARS. THIS WILL BE REVIEWED YEARLY TO INSURE THE CONDITIONS OF THE LICENSE ARE MET. CO~IISSIONER KREUSER SECONDED THE MOTION. THE MOTION PASSED 5-0. 6. Consider Baptist Church Variance Request Mr. Adrian Sundberg, a representative from the Baptist Church, was present to pre- sent their request for a variance. Mr. Sundberg indicated that the Church is growing and they would like to add a foyer to the front of the Church. The base- ment area under this addition would be used for classrooms and the second floor would be used for a nursery. Chairman Tracy indicated that there is a lot of room to expand to the back arid west of the building. He asked Mr. Sundberg if he felt that because of the present design of the Church, it would not be feasible-to expand in those direc- tions. Mr. Sundberg indicated that it then would be necessary to completely change their plans and that he felt this way was the most cheap and feasible. Commissioner Pearce inquired how much would have to be changed on the inside of the church. He has looked at the church and the front of the building lines up with the rest of the houses on both sides. If they moved it out as far as they have requested to do, it would be a big problem to expand in another direction. Mr. Sundberg stated that the Church would like to go in another direction, but because of the way the structure is built, they can't and still be able to build it affordably. Commissioner Pearce asked if the Church o\vned the property where the parking lot is presently situated. ML Sundb~rg felt that the Church could not expand in that direction of the parking lot because if they did, it would mean a whole new structure and idea. Planning Commission Minutes April 26, 1982 Page Eleven Commissioner Gunkel asked whether the foyer was just going to be used for seating or an entr~vay, and were there classrooms downstairs. Mr. Sundberg indicated it was an entryway to be used as fellowship, but it could be used for seating, possibly doubling the size. He further indicated that there were classrooms downstairs of the Church at the present time. Chairman Tracy asked if the Church knew about the standards that were to be en- forced in order for a variance to be granted. The question in point was would this cause a hardship and also who was creating this hardship. Mr. Sundberg indicated that the Church knew about the standards. He felt that the people of the Church were creating the hardship, stating that the Church is full. Commissioner Pearce felt that it would be difficult to approve this variance re- quest because it has to cause an undue hardship. Also, this does not have an im- pact on the City. Discussion followed regarding the hardship being caused by something the Church is doing. Setbacks were also discussed. MOTION BY COMMISSIONER PEARCE TO DENY THE VARIANCE REQUEST BY THE ELK RIVER BAPTIST CHURCH BECAUSE THE CHURCH COULD NOT MEET ALL THE STANDARDS SET FORTH FOR A VARIANCE TO BE GRANTED. SECONDED BY COMMISSIONER GUNKEL. MOTION PASSED 5-0. 7. Consider Variance Request by Mr. and Mrs. Leslie Anderson Mr. Les Anderson, 208 Lowell, presented his request for a variance to the Planning Commission. Mr. Anderson wishes to build to the east side of the building a 12 x 14 foot double garage, used to store antique cars. Mrs. Elaine Anderson stated that they live on the Mississippi River and their home is nonconforming because of the Wild and Scenic River Act. She indicated that they were not encroaching on anybody elses property. They are within the proper setbacks of the City's ordinance. Rick Breezee explained his discussion with the DNR in St. Cloud. He was first given the \ITong information regarding the requirement of the DNR in relation to the Andersons. After getting the correct information, he indicated the DNR would have no problem if the addition was parallel to the river, or going further away from the river. Because this addtion would encroach within the 75 foot setback requirement of the DNR, the City has to approach the problem through their variance procedure. Discussion followed regarding whether this was a hardship or not. The rest of the standards can be met. Also, comments regarding various ideas and thoughts regarding the do\vutown area and what granting this request could mean to the downtown area. COMMISSIONER FREDERICKSEN MOVED TO APPROVE THIS REQUEST FOR A VARIANCE BY MR. AND MRS. LESLIE ANDERSON. CO~illISSIONER KREUSER SECONDED THE MOTION. THE MOTION PASSED 3-2. CHAIRMAN TRACY AND COMMISSIONER GUNKEL VOTED NO, COMMISSIONER KREUSER, COMMIS- SIONER FREDERICKSEN, AND CO}1MISSIONER PEARCE VOTED YES. Planning Commission Minutes April 26, 1982 Page T\velve 8. Consider Zone Change and Interpretation Staff indicated to the Planning Commission this request reflects Mr. Tom Hipsag, 19873 175th Avenue m~, but that Mr. Hipsag has not formally requested this change. The request is for an interpretation from the Commission as to where the R-la zone and I-I zone are divided. City Council member Larry Toth indicated that the City Council has asked for a definement of the line. It was not the intent of the Councilor the Planning Commission to make residents in that area nonconforming. If the Planning Com- mission "tvants to define the line 200 feet \Vest of \vhere it iSmno\v ,<,then that is where it can be put. Rick Breezee stated that the line appears to fall dO\Vll the center of Section 32. This is the arbitrary line that separates the zones. Two things should be looked at: First, as Mr. Toth indicated, the Planning Commission can determine if the line should be moved so that the residents can be conforming. Secondly, the City Administrator and the Mayor has informed him that the City Council will probably review the whole area with the possibility of creating an R-Ia zone or A-I zone as opposed to all zoned Industrial. Rick Breezee further indicated that another area in the City has already been rezoned Industrial, and he did not know if there was a need for more Industrial zoned areas. Councilmember Larry Toth indicated that Cargil Farms controls over 1,000 acres in that area of Industrial zone. It is very unlikely that the City will see develop- ment with that o"tvuership; it will probably stay agricultural. Discussion followed as to Mr. Hipsags reasons that he would like to see the line moved. This would affect only two houses if that was done. Commissioner Pearce indicated that if this area goes to all Agricultural, then all remaining Industrial land thats left will be in the hands of one o\vuer. Rick Breezee indicated that at this time, they were not concerned with the whole area but only the area that pertains to Mr. Hipsag. CO~lliISSIONER PEARCE MADE A MOTION THAT THE LINE BE MOVED OVER TO INCLUDE MR. HIPSAG AT 19873 l75TH AVENUE NORTHWEST, AND THE HOUSE NEXT TO HIM$TO INCLUDE THEM IN THE RESIDENTIAL AREA. COMMISSIONER CUNKEL SECONDED THE MOTION. THE MOTION PASSED 5-0. Staff stated that the line would be moved over just to accomodate Mr. Hipsag's property. It was also indicated that the boundary line for this would be Mr. Hip- sag's westerly section line. 9. Consider Zone Change Request by ~rr. Chip Martin Mr. Chip Martin was present for the zone change request to have this zone changed. Mr. Martin indicated that this zone was changed about a year and a half ago from Commercial to Industrial. Mr. Martin would like to have it changed back to Com- mercial to conform with the best use of that area. Mr. Martin further indicated that his building \Vas rebuilt in 76'-77' to conform to retail shops and \vould like Planning Commission Minutes April 26, 1982 Page Thirteen Chairman Tracy inquired about the setbacks. Rick Breezee stated that front yard setabcks in Industrial zoned areas is 50 feet. In this area, an industrial business could not be built because of the setbacks. The only thing that could go in that area was commercial. Discussion followed regarding the HRA plan. They have not decided how far up this should go. Commissioner Pearce felt that the area south of the tracks was completely divorced from the area north of the tracks. He indicated that this should be included in the study. He did not think they should only take a little chunk and make it C-3. Rick Breezee stated that this is really difficult for two reasons. First of all, if it remains, 1-2, the Feedmill remains conforming but Mr. Martin is nonconform- ing. If it was changed to C-3, Mr. Martin would become conforming and the Feed- mill would be nonconforming. Councilman Toth indicated that first of all there is a dedicated street on the west end of the Plaza and secondly, the staff should look at the parking regula- tions for his present establishment. This may hinder any other type of establish- ment going on the east because of limitations of parking. Councilman Toth doesn't want to see this okayed and then find out the parking is inadequate. Mr. Martin indicated that he has an acre of land to the west of the building. Rick Breezee indicated that Mr. Martin would have to create the parking lot hard surfaced and dust free. He then indicated that before any decision can be made regarding this, staff will check into what are the existing parking conditions and also look into how far exactly the C-3 should be expanded. Chairman Tracy asked if. the Feedmill should be notified of the possible change. Rick Breezee stated that when this went to a public hearing, the Feedmill would be notified. The problem of sanitary sewer was also discussed. Rick Breezee stated that Mr. Martin would have to provide sanitary facilities for the tennants of the build- ing. Rick Breezee indicated that Mr. Martin does not have on the easterly portion, enough space to get the 10 foot separation from the yard line that is required. Mr. Martin would then have to get a variance. The second problem is that the sewer line is across the highway and it would be a problem for connection. He also felt that his present system accomodates the usage now; but if he expands, he would either have to expand his present system or hook up, either of which would be costly. Chairman Tracy entertained a motion to table this request for further study by staff. Planning Commission Minutes April 26, 1982 Page Fourteen COMMISSIONER GUNKEL MADE A MOTION TO TABLE THE ZONE CHANGE REQUEST BY MR. CHIP MARTIN UNTIL THE PLANNING COMMISSION HAS MORE FEEDBACK ON THE 1) HRA PLAN AND HOW FAR WEST IT WILL BE LOOKED AT, 2) THE PARKING, 3) SANITARY Sm~ER SYSTEM, 4) CONFORMING OR NONCONFORMING OF THE FEEDMILL. DOROTHY FRED- ERICKSEN SECONDED THE MOTION. THE MOTION PASSED 5-0. Mr. Martin asked if he could get on the Planning Commission special meeting. The Planning Commission indicated that this could be put on the agenda for May 10th. 10. Spot Zoning Discussion followed and relating to spot zoning. no motion was needed. Rick Breezee gave the Planning Commission a memo This was only for the Planning Commission's review, 11. R~2 Spot Zoning - Discussion Commissioner Pearce indicated that the whole problem sterns from a typographical error. Rick Breezee stated it was and further stated that the reason for the memo was only to verify the R-2. Gary Santwire indicated that he still doesn't understand the R-2 zone. He asked how a developer would know what the density units per acre would be. Rick Breezee stated that that has been established and the question about density units has always been there. It was only a typographical error. The density unit is 8 per acre or 30% of coverage. Discussion followed regarding density units. Rick Breezee explained the standards for R-2 zone as stated in the ordinance. This involved the items of o\vuership and rentals. If the builder informs him they have a 60' wide lot and it will be ownership, the builders would go through an Administrative Subdivision to get the lot line dO\Vll the center. If the builder indicates it will be on a rental, Rick Breezee then takes the word of the builder. Although if at a later date, they have the type of construction that it could possibly become ownership, they will have to apply for an Administrative Subdivision. Rick Breezee also indicated that a duplex is allowed in an R-2 zone. If a duplex is rental, it is only one principal structure with 2 rental units. If it is in- dividual o\vuership, it is 2 principal units. Rick Breezee also stated that if a person wanted to get an Administrative Subdivision for four lots or less, only the City Council approval. is needed. If it is five lots or more, the Planning Commission approval and City Council approval is needed. Planning Commission Minutes April 26, 1982 Page Fifteen ll~. Discussion of Lundgren concept presented by Rick Foster Rick Breezee indicated that Rick Foster, representing Ted Lundgren, was present to discuss the concept of a new proposal by Mr. Lundgren. He stated this was not a public hearing and no motion would be necessary. Rich Barakat, representing homeowners involved in this area, stated his feelings in regard to this item. He stated that there was no way any of the homeowners would know about this item being put on the agenda and he further asked how does the public know about a meeting. Rick Breezee stated again this was not a public hearing. When this proposal is presented, the homeowners within 350 feet of the project involved, would be noti- fied by mail and also the notice would be published in the Star News, ten days prior to the public hearing. Discussion followed regarding the public hearing process with the Planning Commis~ sian. The only public hearing the Planning Commission holds is for preliminary plat approval. Rick Foster presented his ideas to the Planning Commission. The proposal will be 17~ acres. The density units would be R-3 - 8.2 acres, R-lc - 3.03 acres, with overall density being 4.4 units per acre. 4 acres would be to\vuhouse in the south- west corner. Everything else would be single family detached homes. Gary Santwire stated that he would support his plan 100%. It is totally different from their last proposal. A member of the audience inquired if this would be total rezoning. Rick Foster stated it would only be R-lc which is needed for single family homes. The R-lb would be rezoned. It was the general feeling of the Planning Commission that they would like to see Rick Foster There being no further business, A MOTION WAS MADE BY COMMISSIONER PEARCE TO~ ADJOURN THE MEETING. COMMISSIONER GUNKEL SECONDED THE MOTION. THE MOTION PASSED 5-0. The meeting was adjourned at 10:30 p.m. ~~tf~ submitted, X~~ Rick Breezee Building and Zoning Administrator RB:cl